Last Updated:July 25 @ 08:15 pm

Limbaugh: Obama Barreling Toward Real Fiscal Cliff

By David Limbaugh

Some commentators wonder why President Obama always engages in brinksmanship. Why can't he meet Republicans halfway, like Clinton did, they ask. Let me try to respond.

One blogger suggests that Obama prefers to play chicken, taking the nation right to the edge of a fiscal disaster because it will increase the likelihood that the GOP will cave. Perhaps, but there's more to it.

Many of us warned that Obama is not, by nature or ideology, a conciliator. He is not a centrist, and he's not someone who is interested in the other side's ideas. He knows what he wants to do, and he is hell-bent on doing it. He is not just playing hardball as a matter of strategy; he has no interest in compromise and is angling to get his way entirely. And he wants to further damage the Republican brand in the process.

The way Obama probably looks at it is that Republicans will cave and he will either get most of what he wants, or the Republicans will hold fast and he can effectively blame them for taking us over the fiscal cliff. You'll note that in none of these explanations is there a hint that Obama is motivated to do what is best for the country. He intends to act in his own best interests and those of his party, and decidedly against the interests of the GOP and, ultimately, the nation.

To better understand what we're dealing with and what the stakes are in these negotiations, let's take a look at what people mean when they say we're headed toward a fiscal cliff in January -- as distinguished from the much bigger cliff we're heading for if we don't get our deficits and debt under control very soon.

The immediate fiscal cliff includes the largest tax increase in a single year in our nation's history ($494 billion), dangerous defense cuts via sequestration, a Medicare reimbursement fiasco and an expiration of federal funding for extended unemployment benefits.

Despite these looming concerns, Obama hasn't approached these budget talks in good faith, but in a way that even former defenders recognize is designed to result in an impasse. Indeed, Obama's proposal is so manifestly unreasonable that even his own party - Democratic senators and congressmen -- has consistently rejected less extreme versions of it in its unanimous votes against his budgets.

Consider: He chose Timothy Geithner to be his lead negotiator. Geithner has repeatedly shown he is not serious about entitlement reform. He and the president have failed even to put a proposal on the table. Also, they've proposed no real short-term spending cuts, twice the level of tax increases Obama campaigned on, more stimulus spending, an intransigent demand for an economy-smothering tax rate increase on the "wealthy" as opposed to decreases in deductions, and the topper: a demand that Congress surrender to this reckless spender of a president its constitutional prerogative over spending limits.

The upshot is that Obama is demanding Republicans agree to policies that will further damage the economy and ensure the nation's financial demise even sooner than is now inevitable. Adding insult to injury, Geithner is arrogantly boasting that Republicans will cave.

Republicans are agreeing to let Obama increase taxes (by reducing deductions for upper income earners) even with the anemic economy, but are demanding from him, on behalf of the nation, serious discretionary spending cuts and major structural entitlement reform. If Republicans cave in exchange for Obama's vague, illusory, insincere promises to cut spending and reform entitlement down the road, they will be complicit in accelerating the nation's fiscal destruction.

Some painfully superficial analysts argue that Obama is right to offer an extreme position as his first volley, because that's the way negotiations work. But Obama's hardball offer is not merely a different approach to the shared goal of restoring the nation's fiscal health. It unequivocally guarantees national bankruptcy while the Republicans' proposal is designed to avert that disaster.

Obama is playing chicken, all right, but he's not driving his own car; he's driving the United States of America. People can quibble endlessly over whether he is intentionally trying to harm America. The better way to frame it is that Obama is, by his own admission, trying to fundamentally transform America.

His transforming vision means continuing to expand the welfare state, major tax hikes, increased spending and obstructing reform of our already insolvent entitlement programs, the major debt drivers that are leading us toward the real "fiscal cliff."

Obama's policies in furtherance of his vision -- as clearly laid out during the campaign and even more so during these "fiscal cliff" negotiations -- left unchecked will complete the fiscal destruction of the nation.

So if you insist, don't call it intentional destruction. Call it, euphemistically, "the intentional fundamental transformation of America that will necessarily destroy her."

---

David Limbaugh is a writer, author and attorney. His latest book, "The Great Destroyer," reached No. 2 on the New York Times best-seller list for nonfiction. Follow him on Twitter @davidlimbaugh and his website at www.davidlimbaugh.com.

COPYRIGHT 2012 CREATORS.COM

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57 Comments

  1. goodforallComment by goodforall
    December 4, 2012 @ 9:23 am

    Let’s face it-this is exactly what the fake in chief wants. He even told us he wanted redistribution of wealth and to fundamentally transform America. So the sheep and entitlement seekers put him in for another term (I am still not convinced he was re-elected legally-way too much voter fraud). He is simply finishing the job he promised when he started back in 2008. I think the Republicans should simply walk away and let him own this disaster-they are gonna be blamed anyway!

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    • way2coolComment by way2cool
      December 4, 2012 @ 11:23 am

      I agree! The Repubs. and Congress should vote ‘PRESENT’ (just as obama did), let him tumble off the cliff. He can blame the Repubs. from now to infinity and the only one who will be that will be obama himself. Then the true Americans can decide, after the fact, how to replace this administration since no one seems motivated to do it now.

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    • mb900Comment by mb900
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:03 pm

      The only way obama will flip the house in 2014 is if WE DON’T SUPERVISE city election workers.. As you must already know that city election workers helped obama steal this past Nov election in FL, OH, and other states. Don’t forget city workers are mainly minority workers like african americans and lationos and they are mainly pro-Union=democrats completely in charge of our elections.. And NOBODY is supervising them.
      I urge all concerned republicans to volunteer as POLL WATCHER, to learn the voting rules and ENFORCE THEM at the election day and even early election days and more importantly, to stay inside of the Poll Precinct UNTIL THE VOTES are counted and collected from the machines. This is the most important step since when the poll closes, nobody is supervising pro-union democrats and they have ballots and machines all for themselves. THIS IS ONE WAY to stop voting fraud.

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    • stickmanComment by stickman
      December 5, 2012 @ 5:36 pm

      and – Obama is going to win. AND – YOU are going to pay.

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  2. dialectic1Comment by dialectic1
    December 4, 2012 @ 9:42 am

    Virtually the entire Republican/Conservative community is approaching this entire struggle in the wrong way! We neded to build a vast Conservative majority in this country, and traditional political dealing will NOT do that. What we need to do is GIVE Obama everything he wants. We should say we are doing this because otherwise, the country will go nowhere for the next four years, and warn that there are real dangers – economic and social – to the country as a result of doing this – but then go ahead and do it. This will not seem any more hypocritical than stalling the country for four years (which is what otherwise would happen – unless we get blamed for stalling and that’s even worse). When the country then defaults and disintegrates, we can then say We Told You So, and begin to truly pick up the pieces with an electorate that by then will deeply and genuinely understand that Obama’s policies were destructive. Nothing but hitting the social and economic gutter in this way will turn the electorate around with any degree of permanence for Constitutional and Conservative government.

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    • freethinkerComment by freethinker
      December 4, 2012 @ 4:16 pm

      I do not believe that this is the way to handle our problem in this country. Smacks a little to much of grade school. And in four years of unopposed policies of obamaism, there very likely will be no country left to pick up

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    • dshevlinComment by dshevlin
      December 4, 2012 @ 4:24 pm

      @dialectic1 – I was in that mindset for a while too. It is a logical approach typically, but this is far from a typical situation and MUST be treated with kid gloves. Tell ya the truth SO far I am proud of the repubs. & House moves on the chess board. Reports were they were going to cave, but they presented yet another feasible plan that the dems rejected. Duly note: The dems have NO written plan – only verbal. Repubs./House have had several written plans just no acceptance. In writing beats verbal everyday. What we are seeing is I hope the result of realizing that no matter what repubs do they will be blamed for any bad results. NO matter which avenue is chosen – even obama’s – they all result in something negative to we the people. SO, why cave then. Might as well hold your ground because that ground will in the end be what will avert this cliff. Giving bo what he wants means for certain the end of our lives as we used to know them. He will be able to raise the debt ceiling anytime he wants including now if his plan is caved in to. There is NO debt ceiling increase in any repub plan. That is a crucial turning point that must be averted. If we go with NO deal the cliff is: tax increases and “sharp” spending cuts. If we go with bo’s deal we get higher debt ceilings, more stimulus spending and tax increases. NO House/repub. bill is going to pass the senate because all their bills have spending cuts and/or tax relief. So the cliff or bo is what we are looking at and the cliff is the safer fall. My opinion of course. STAND for something if you’re going down anyway. Stay strong repubs! The goal should be to put as LITTLE money as possible back in bo’s greedy deceitful fingers. Because the money is how he is destroying our country. Slow that down if that is all you can do, and it is all we can do right now. I think this may be what the repubs are doing.

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    • empty pocketsComment by empty pockets
      December 5, 2012 @ 9:03 am

      Give Obama what he wants???! He wants to sink our ship of state and you want to turn off the pumps and smash the life boats. Standing upon principle is not hypocritical; spouting principles publicly then abandoning them behind closed doors is. Trading your and our souls is worse than hypocritical. Anyway, why would you think going over the cliff isn’t giving Obama what he wants? No, it isn’t ALL he wants and it’s better than any alternative being offered (which would be refused if we took it anyway. He’d demand more as he did before.) In his game, all tax rates will go up, GOP will be the bad guys, the increased taxes due to Obamacare also kicking in will be overshadowed. Then when the next Congress is seated, he’ll spout more “words, just words”…saying NOW, with more reasonable people, he hopes, a better deal can be negotiated. HE will see to it, HE will save us. HE will demand congress give tax relief to all but the top 2%. And that’s when the GOP will be in an even tighter corner. If you give in to a bully, you get bullied more often and harder. The GOP better get used to it. We’ve got two years to sell the conservative message better than we’ve done with “electable moderates” as messengers. There are even a few Senators whose terms end next year. There’s no reason to think that any message delivered by people who say one thing and do the opposite won’t continue to fall on deaf ears. We have to have the courage of our convictions or we might as well change our registration to socialist.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 5, 2012 @ 9:11 am

      emptypockets, I like your enthusiasm and your penchant for calling it like you see it.
      I, too, feel like obama is nothing but a master manipulator who will keep on harping out his tune, even if it means driving the country to ruin.

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    • stickmanComment by stickman
      December 5, 2012 @ 5:44 pm

      That would be nice – to have a “VAST” conservative majority – but it isn’t going to happen. #1 women, #2 those that are on the “free” way of living where “entitlements” are more dollars than working for them. #3 Black Americans (darker skinned, brown, people whose ancestors came from Africa – how ever you want to name that “racist” tune). #4 Hispanics of which ever country – Mexico, Cuba, S. America or our own invaluable Puerto Rico. # 5, Socialists and Communists. #6 Hollywood. #7 the “Mainstream Media”. Conservatives make up perhaps 30%, although I think it is closer to 20% of the population of the United States. 49,000,000 Tea Party members out of 311,000,000 population.

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  3. janicepComment by janicep
    December 4, 2012 @ 9:50 am

    I am NO Obama fan, but I see this issue differently. As a member of the middle class, who took a beating in the stock market during the Recession, I have grown very disenchanted with taxpayer bailouts of those who played fast and loose with our nation’s economy and who now seek to strip Social Security and Medicare benefits from Seniors and others who have paid into the system all their lives. We paid for those bailouts to the wealthy, and we still are getting stiffed. Now, they want to privatize our social security, so they can make money from investing it for us. What on earth would have happened to all of our citizens if everyone’s social security had been invested in the stock market during the Recession? My God, we would have had millions of people reduced to abject poverty. And, STILL, the financiers, who are bailed out by the government (us), would not have suffered one loss. Something is drastically wrong with that.

    I believe that Obama is trying to prevent something like that from occurring, and therefore he is trying to protect those social programs as much as possible. His attempts in that direction have led, in part, to this impasse. But, the Republicans are even more to blame, with their unrestrained support of the very wealthy, who have created jobs ONLY in other countries since the 1980′s. I DO support Obama’s efforts to protect SS and Medicare. Social Security should NEVER be touched, because it does not contribute one dime to the deficit. It is self-funded. In fact, it would have much more money in it if the Congress had not used the money we paid into it for other things. It should be in a “lock box”, so it can NEVER be touched again.

    For further clarification, please read the article here:

    http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/obscenely-rich-men-bent-shredding-safety-net?akid=9747.211699.Ey5cG8&rd=1&src=newsletter754638&t=4

    This article lays out who is behind the effort to destroy the social security programs and why. In all my life, I have never seen anything so greedy and heinous. Politicians have all become greedy and do not guard the good of our country and our people any longer. They are concerned only with the amount of money they can get for their next campaign – and from whom it comes. They are leading our country into ruin, just as they did when they gave tax subsidies to corporations that closed their doors, leaving millions of Americans out of work, while they relocated in Communist China and other slave-wage paying countries. I am SO sick of all politicians in both parties. NO ONE is looking out for our country any longer. I see this as economic treason, and its participants ought to be treated accordingly.

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    • goodforallComment by goodforall
      December 4, 2012 @ 9:57 am

      The wealthy are the ones who create jobs! Most Republicans know this. You need to understand what made us successful-and that the wealthy already pay their fair share in taxes. We need massive entitlement reform-and no one ever mentions the out of control food stamp and welfare programs. Even the illegals are getting these-and that is totally ridiculous! Bottom line, it is spending cuts we need, not tax reform.

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    • bna42Comment by bna42
      December 4, 2012 @ 10:05 am

      “I DO support Obama’s efforts to protect SS and Medicare.”

      janicep, Do you really think Obama is trying to protect medicare when he wants to steal billions from the program to pay for his signature socialist government takeover of health insurance known as Obamacare? How is bankrupting medicare in order to use the money for expanding medicaid going to “protect” medicare? How is medicare going to be protected when provider reimbursements are cut so much that most providers refuse to accept medicare? Have you tried to find a doctor who will accept new medicare patients recently?

      What is Obama doing to protect Social Security? What plan has he offered? What are his ideas to make it solvent?

      Obama is a master of talking in general, ambiguous terms in order to create the impression that he has a plan, but the details are never explained, so the people form their own conclusions regarding what they think he meant. We have seen this maneuver since the day he remarked that he wanted to “fundamentally transform America” and no one asked him exactly how he intended to do that. Instead of his flowing rhetoric, we need to see the details and let US decide if his plan is viable.

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    • janicepComment by janicep
      December 4, 2012 @ 10:34 am

      Hi Goodforall. You’re right, the wealthy do create jobs. BUT, they have been creating jobs ONLY in Communist China, Muslim Pakistan, and other slave wage-paying countries for the last 30 years. We WERE a great and prosperous nation from WWII and through the 1970′s, because US corporations and the wealthy invested their money in THIS country, by building factories and hiring US citizens, so they could buy the products the factories made and so this country had something to sell abroad. That is no longer true. Look around your own state. How many plants and jobs have been lost to off-shoring jobs just there? Over 50,000 plants have shut their doors and moved overseas since 1980, putting millions of Americans out of work. Even white collar jobs have been lost this way. That has wrecked our economy. The wealthy have wrecked it by moving those jobs out of our own country. They are HUGELY to blame for our current situation. Further, NO American worker can compete with – or should have to – workers in those countries, who work for 50 cents an hour. Corporations and the wealthy now consider themselves “globalists”, having NO allegiance to ANY country, including this one. That is what has caused the downfall of the US. Can you imagine how prosperous the US and our citizens would be – and how low our trade balance would be – if those corporations and the wealthy would have left their factories in the US? We have lost more than money, I’m afraid. We have lost all manner of decency and our own soul. Our politicians and our corporations have sold it for a few pieces of silver.

      I agree with you about the welfare programs. I personally knew quite a few people who are on disability and other such programs, but don’t belong there at all. One just bought a brand new car and gets everything imaginable free. Her daughter is now 19 and has never worked or even finished school, but she is getting Pell and other grants to go to college, which she signs up for, but never finishes. Her mother has deliberatley debilitated her daughter, and she is now trying to get her on disability. This woman’s annual income from disability and other programs is about $50,000. Another has been deemed 100% permanently disabled, but plays tennis and rides her bike every day. She is not disabled at all. Further, there are MANY abuses in the system. We pay for generations for millions of babies born out of wedlock to parents who have no intention to ever marry because that would mean a loss of government support. So, neither parent is responsible for the children they bring into the world. Instead, you and I pay for them. Generation after generation learns that there is money in doing nothing but having babies. ALL of that needs to be changed. We need a complete review of all the welfare programs, and we need to weed out the many who don’t belong there and who ought to be working. Many are at fault. But, the corporations and the wealthy, who create jobs ONLY OVERSEAS, are by far the worse offenders and have left our country without a future.

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    • msconservative444Comment by msconservative444
      December 4, 2012 @ 10:38 am

      Social Security will not last at this rate anyway. I would rather see it privatized-it will still make money.
      Taxing the wealthy is pure folly, they will just take their money elsewhere and pay no taxes on it.
      The next step for this president will be to take over our 401 Ks to fund his ridiculous plans for redistribution. If you have any doubt that this man gives a good ******* about this country just wait for the next 4 years. We elected these people in office to fight for us. Should we just give up and let him take this country down the tubes? No one mentions what is really stalling recovery-it’s the federal regulations on industry. If they were lifted the wealthy would invest more in this country and employ many others inthe process.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 10:44 am

      Janicep, I find your assessment of this fiscal cliff even more interesting than Limbaugh’s. The reason being that the tiny excerpts of the daily speeches obama has delivered for for years now, ad nauseum, basically say what you are saying. It all falls under that heading of “tell the same lie often enough and people begin to believe it.” And, I admit that it does sound reasonable.

      My problem is that, as someone who’s ON social security seeing the bottom line diminish with raises to medicare premiums and state governments dipping out their share of pensions and such I now that it is insincere hogwash! If you think for one minute that someone isn’t paying for all this happiness and that includes social security and medicare recipients, you are sadly mistaken.

      Social Security funds SHOULD be put in a locked box and not touched for any reason other than the originally intended use — to give back to the people who worked and put those funds in there. We didn’t ask to be fleeced ever week all those years we worked. Our employers didn’t beg someone to let them match the amount for the privilege of being in business and having employees. Nobody had a choice.

      Today, the gov’t shouldn’t be dipping into those funds for someone’s handicapped offspring, someone who’s disabled because of a tragic accident, etc. There are other avenues available for those situations that should have kept it apart from social security funds. Now, they complain because people live too long or people get sick with more expenisve diseases to cure so we are all of a sudden a burden on the people who are collecting from the social security fund who shouldn’t be. That isn’t right.

      Quite frankly, I resent that the government flat out stole the money from the social security fund and it started with LBJ’s “war on poverty” from my vantage point. Since that first money grab, it got easier and easier for the government to steal from the senior citizens of this country.

      You mentioned the bailout. Remember the big show of solidarity during the 2008 election campaign when McCain and Obama ran back to Washington to do their jobs for a change? People seem to leave out the part where obama gave even more money to the bailout recipients and nobody ever bothered to ask where any of that money went. It was all Bush’s fault and that is BS. Congress pretty much unanimously voted to steal taxpayer money and bail out the bankers but they neglected to make any provisions to keep track of that money or make provisions for it to be paid back. Our heads are still spinning over that one!

      Obama turned around and appointed his thieving buddies as “czars” of this and that, giving them the green light to steal some more if they so desire because nobody can hold them accountable as individuals any more than obama can be held accountable for any crimes he commits as president. That isn’t right!

      I’m not saying we wouldn’t be singing this same song today if McCain had been elected or that we wouldn’t have been singing the same song in 2012 if Romney had been elected. I’m saying it is not right. The fact that anyone can sing the praises of a man who has gone out of his way to make a big mess into a bigger one for this nation just becauase he can spew flowery words while he’s doing it is beyond my comprehension.

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    • bna42Comment by bna42
      December 4, 2012 @ 10:52 am

      “Over 50,000 plants have shut their doors and moved overseas since 1980, putting millions of Americans out of work.”

      janicep, I know you probably won’t believe this, but the business owners didn’t move overseas simply because they were greedy. I know that’s what Obama wants you to believe, and obviously you have fallen for that. However, the changes since 1980 when manufacturing left the U.S. can be blamed on MORE government regulations, HIGHER taxes on business, OUTRAGEOUS union demands, and now the EXCESSIVE costs mandated by Obamacare.

      Contrary to your opinion, businesses are NOT in business to provide people with jobs because people are not “entitled” to jobs. They are in business to make a product, sell their product at a profit, and allow a reasonable return on investment for the owner. If this can’t be accomplished in the U.S. under oppression, it will be accomplished overseas.

      The same principle applies to the “wealthy”. They are not stupid and they will not allow their wealth to be confiscated by the government. They are not required to keep their wealth in the U.S. and they are fed up, they will move it overseas.

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    • janicepComment by janicep
      December 4, 2012 @ 11:01 am

      Hi msconservative. Social Security WILL last, if they replace the money they stole from it to fund other programs and if they lock it so no more money can be taken from it. They OWE that to us, because it is OUR money, which was deducted from our paychecks all the years we were working.

      The WORST possible idea is to eliminate SS and privatize it. AGAIN, in the case of another stock market crash, the investors would lose EVERYTHING (and that includes Seniors), just as I did in a couple of companies. Then what? Are you prepared to support your newly-impoverished parents? Even the companies that made it through the recession ended up paying me dividends of less than fourth of what they had been before the Recession. NO ONE can live on less than one fourth of their retirement income, unless they are very rich. If SS is privatized, that is what will happen to millions more. It is a good thing I have Social Security to supplement the stock income I have left. Otherwise, I would not be able to survive. I’m sure you don’t want to be placed in that situation. Nor would you want it for your children or your parents. We must be very careful and circumspect when we are dealing with the lives of others and ourselves. They should not be subjected to a game of chance, which is what the stock market is. NO ONE should invest in the stock market more than they can easily AFFORD to LOSE. This is not just an issue of making a little profit here and there with some extra money; it is an issue of having financial security for our own future. I am living proof of that. NO, we MUST have a neutral and PROTECTED Social Security fund, run by the government – and one for which we don’t have to pay fees to brokers. When the companies in which I was invested, went belly up during the Recession, they got bailed out by the tax payers. But nobody bailed ME out, and I lost everything that was invested in a couple of those companies. That is exactly what would happen to our SS money if it were invested in the stock market. From very, very recent experience, we can all see that we would lose EVERYTHING in the event of another downturn. We cannot put our own future in such jeopardy. I will fight to the death to preserve SS, because it is my LIFE you are talking about when you seek to privatize this program. You need to realize that it is also YOUR life and the life of your parents and children with which you seek to place on the gambling table. That is not prudent by any stretch of the imagination.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 11:07 am

      msconservative444, I absolutely agree with you that the reason that companies left this country and took their manufacturing operations elsewhere is because of government regluations that made it impossible for them to stay in business. While I don’t like it and I avoid buying things that were not made in the USA if at all possible, I understand their position. Furthermore, I’ve lived in a third world country and I can assure you that those people, even though we think they are working for a pittance, feel the same security we felt in the 40′s, 50′s and 60′s when things were cranking here in the USA.
      Ever heard of NAFTA? Bill Clinton started those trade agreements that helped encourage American businesses to leave. NAFTA took effect after Bush became president but it wasn’t his baby. It was succeeded by other trade agreements that made it unhealthy for American manufacturing to survive in the USA. What were they thinking??

      In the 1970′s many of the businesses were driven from the big cities by unions. Major manufacturers relocated to southern states where “right to work” laws prevented people could not be forced to join a union in order to have a job.

      But when the government started forcing companies to do things that cut deeper into the profit margin, it was no longer viable to stay at all. A lot of US businesses in TX went across the border first, then moved on to Asia because the Mexican workers were invading the USA looking for the life they didn’t realize was already being pulled out from under Americans by their own government. (Hoover, Electrolux, Maytag and half a dozen or more textile mills.)Now we pay top dollar for third rate junk that may or may not poison us because our government can’t seem to stay focused on the USA as opposed to every third world region on earth that they might manipulate. It’s really sad.

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    • bjfscfComment by bjfscf
      December 4, 2012 @ 11:15 am

      The commentary by JANICEP should be read by all Constitutional Conservatives who have devoted the time necessary to educate themselves on the history of our republic, the Progressive movement and its strategies, and are frustrated by the seemingly illogical comments that are made by good people who have not followed the same path, and thus are not as well informed. “janicep” is expressing the extreme frustration felt by the majority (I believe)of people who feel they are being taken advantage of by virtually everyone who appears to be wealthy enough to not be suffering as they are. It is easy to understand why they feel that way, as the main stream press, our education system, and the neighbor next door provide support for their feelings. The American people have literally been taught to disrespect financial success, to think of “free enterprise” and “capitalism” as oppressors of everyone not enjoying the benefits of such an economic system, and to believe they are victims of an economic system that is designed to keep them from having a successful life. Constitutional Conservatives, whether affluent or not, you will have to learn how to relate to those who do not believe as we do, who have not had the same upbringing, education, or experiences we have had. Otherwise, those who, for over 100 years, have planned the “fundamental transformation” of the system that has provided the unmatched prosperity and personal freedom envied by the millions who have even broken our immigration laws in an effort to share in what we have, will achieve their goal — and the expanded misery that will move the “janicep’s” further into poverty will not convince them of the mistake they have made, as they will never believe the cause of their plight was the successful “fundamental transformation” perpetrated on our society.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 11:17 am

      Janicep said: “Social Security WILL last, if they replace the money they stole from it to fund other programs”

      I’m curious where you think they should steal the money from to put back the money they stole from Social Security.

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    • JDZComment by JDZ
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:30 pm

      Well..you certainly have stirred up the comments on this conservative website, haven’t you? The reason you are getting the comments you are getting is that we can all see how brainwashed you are and misinformed on what is actually happening in the political arena around you. Do not feel bad about it as you are one of the millions of Americans that voted to re-elect one of the most dangerous and radical men ever to become President in our history. Someone how has nothing but distain for our Constitution and Bill of Rights. Someone who has no real interest in preserving Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid but has convinced you that it is he who will save the American people from these radical Republicans how are hellbent to destroy these government safety nets. Etc.

      We know that this administration is spending the country into an imminent fiscal disaster and has zero interest in cutting the cost of government or reforming programs like Medicare to save them based on his actions, not his words.

      You cannot really believe that Republicans like Romney or Ryan really want their grandparents or friends who depend on these programs to lose their benefits, do you? Why would they want members of their family or their friends lose SS, Medicare, or Medicaid? The answer is that they wouldn’t. Paul Ryan is the ONLY member in Congress who has actually put together a plan to save Medicare from going bankrupt and it preserves benefits for current members and offers options for those coming up toward the age when they have to decide including staying in the current SS program.

      You need to do some broader, more independent research, into how government at all levels is in big trouble and, over the years, has set us on a path to a painful financial disaster driven by massive entitlements that are growing beyond any rational way to pay for them.

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    • Jota_Comment by Jota_
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:39 pm

      “Now, they want to privatize our social security, so they can make money from investing it for us. What on earth would have happened to all of our citizens if everyone’s social security had been invested in the stock market during the Recession?” – janicep

      You could not be more wrong, not that your money would have been lost in the private market, but you are wrong to think the Federal government has not lost it, already, too.

      http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/112812-634984-401k-on-the-table-for-fiscal-cliff.htm?p=2

      “Between 1937 and 2009, Social Security took in nearly $14 trillion in payroll tax revenue.

      In all but 11 of those years, the government collected more than it spent on benefits.”

      YET!

      http://usdebtclock.org/
      122 trillion in UNFUNDED liabilities

      WHICH MEANS

      http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323353204578127374039087636.html

      “In short, if the government confiscated the entire adjusted gross income of these American taxpayers, plus all of the corporate taxable income in the year before the recession, it wouldn’t be nearly enough to fund the over $8 trillion per year in the growth of U.S. liabilities”

      So tell me again what it is you think Obama is trying to prevent from occurring?

      Entitlement programs need reform now, Obama trying to save his own skin by hoping to make victims of the Republicans is not a plan but the mark of a coward.

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    • KMcCComment by KMcC
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:45 pm

      janicep
      It seems you really do not understand what has happened. You have read the media BS and believed it. WOW, most major newpapers have a “financial writer”, if you read their arguments carefully you should see how biased they are and are avocating STUPID arguments.
      The real analysist have even taken to buying newpaper adds with over a hundred of them signing their names as to how Completely wrong this president and his administration are!.
      As to why so many Companies moved to other counties. Have you heard of UNIONS? They are the Root cause of almost all transfer of manufacting to other counties period. Look at Hostess Brands, the Unions killed that company just because Hostess wanted to use Non-Union drivers for its trucks. Now those18,000 people have no jobs, but they proved how “strong” the Unions are. As said above Government regualations added to the reasons for moving out of county. Yes, some regulations is necessary, but really did Obama’s adminstration need to add Over “85,000 pages” of New Government Reguations to businesses in only 3 years???
      Government Motors Corporation is going bankrupt Again even with over $100 BILLION dollars of Our money being given to them. Yes that is correct if you look at all the Illeagel money and “Bailout” they were given. Where does the law say the President has the right to step in an Confiscate a legitmate Corporation. Soon he will Nationalize most major Corporations just as Other Socialist Nations leaders have Done. Yes, Socialist Democrats, that is what the Democrats have created, a county of A Dependent on Govenment Class of people. Yes, the Republicans DID Not Stand up against them as it seemed a good idea… The Congress of the USA does Not seem to understand PEOPLE or don’t care as long as the Keep their Cushy Congressional positions of Power.

      These are my truely believed understanding. You are entitled yours, but really you should try to get better informed.

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    • lesncComment by lesnc
      December 4, 2012 @ 2:56 pm

      When SS was set at 65 people only lived to 67, today it is 77.
      In the 1940′s there were 44 people supporting each person on SS today it is down to 2 per person on SS. Something has got to give.
      As far as SS in private investment it was only 10 percent and then only if you wanted to, it was not compulsary. Countrys that have SS private accounts do better than those in Government programs.

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    • empty pocketsComment by empty pockets
      December 5, 2012 @ 9:32 am

      Janicep, sweetheart, lay off the Kool Aid. Really. Obamacare is so grossly misnamed…because Obama does not care. Oh, he does care about a few things: himself, his big donors and most powerful supporting minions and advancing his socialist agenda at all costs. But you? Cares about you and “protecting Social Security and Medicare? His policies will destroy them, TRANSFORM them into a far more encompassing welfare state where everyone except the ruling elite will be equally poor, equally miserable.

      Your “idol”, Obama has been guilty of sending more jobs overseas than even Bush. He gave lots of taxpayer money to GE and GM, both of who then opened plants overseas, especially China. Add in the crushing weight of regulations he’s added through the EPA, HHS and others and more jobs have either left the US or just shrivelled up and died.

      I do agree with you that far too many politicians of all party hat colors, don’t care about anything but keeping their own “bone”, the job, benefits, priviledge…oh, and grabbing another bone to hoard if the opportunity presents. Many of them have profited financially from the inside info available to them as legislators. And if Cap and Trade had passed, many, including Obama, would have made a killing…all while killing our future.

      Janicep–the majority of the wealthy he’s targeting didn’t inherit their money, didn’t maarry it. They worked their behinds off long hours, risking much in order to earn that money and along the way, they created opportunities for others. A small business doesn’t just offer jobs itself. It needs support from other businesses who need to hire people to meet increased demand of goods or services. BTW-people earning $200K aren’t “rich” anymore. Lots of them are standing next to you in the line at WalMart.

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    • dshevlinComment by dshevlin
      December 5, 2012 @ 12:50 pm

      @Jan – Ok, you end that comment a little better then you began but go back and re-read yourself after you read me. You say you support obama’s “stance” that you think is saving SS and then you end it with they are leading our country in to ruin. This administration today and for the last 4 years is responsible for this lead in to ruins, they are the ones in power and leading the nation. That is who you blame – WHOMEVER is in power when things suck. I do not see bo as trying to save anything. His payroll tax CUT is only for the employee end, a 3% reduction in wages with held equals a 3% reduction ( per worker ) going in to the SS trust fund for future benefits. THAT is NOT saving SS, THAT is defunding it’s bank account. He has NO other plans to save anything. His plan is BORROW trillions more, give more bail outs and raise taxes. That is not a good plan. Obama’s bailout’s did not go to American job creation, all we got and are getting is the BILL. SS is NOT solvent and neither is the stock market. You are being deceived and if you trust you’re insolvent borrowing administration today up against the private sector for wealth creation then you are still drinking the kool aide. Check these links out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Gan69Wo&feature=youtu.be – this one is on how well the GM bailout worked for we the people. / http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/video/us-bridges-roads-built-chinese-firms-14594513?tab=9482930?ion=1206853&playlist=14594944 – This one is about how well the stimulus job creation bailouts went for we the people. We borrowed future tax payer dollars to fund new roads & bridges for China. Built in America but no Americans got jobs from it. Nice! Now go back and read yourself. We are in the present, yesterday is gone, GW is long gone, Clinton is history, today and the powers of today is what should be looked at only. NONE of the issues we all complain about are being addressed and only made worse by the actions of extremely POOR leadership skills. Not negotiating and putting all the lives of Americans at risk is not good leadership. Say what you want about the repubs but you are not watching them. THEY have plans in writing. Obama has only verbal plans. The repubs plan will work better because the SPENDING will begin to decrease. NO MORE WASTEFUL SPENDING is the only way to save our country. No other way will work. Obama’s plan ends life in America as we know it – the cliff’s plan cuts spending and raises taxes – the repubs plan cuts spending doesn’t raise the debt ceiling and has tax deductions NOT tax increases. The cliff is better then obama’s plan and if no deal is made by your prez with repubs, then the cliff is what is to come. Not so bad, we will endure.

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    • stickmanComment by stickman
      December 5, 2012 @ 5:46 pm

      Obama – and ObamaCare – took $716,000,000,000 (count the zeros) out of Medicare. Oh yes – he’s trying to protect it. and he has AARP in his back pocket.

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  4. rustypatComment by rustypat
    December 4, 2012 @ 9:56 am

    Evil Intent … to achieve his agenda … masked in a charade of being “good for the middle class”. His destruction of the Free Enterprise system will be the demise of the middle class into pure Socialism, without the incentive to be self-motivating.

    He may not be the Anti-Christ, but he is the Anti-Leader, Anti-American, Anti-Democracy, Anti-Free Enterprise, Anti-President, Anti-Patriot.

    Obama-Nation is an Abomination.

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    • jarhead0311Comment by jarhead0311
      December 4, 2012 @ 10:11 am

      Jesus Christ had John the Baptist.
      The Anti-Christ has Barack Obama.

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    • janicepComment by janicep
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:47 pm

      You hit the nail on the head when you described Obama as an “anti-leader”. He seemed to have shirked those leadership duties the very minute he was sworn in. I was never so disappointed in anyone in my entire life. In what did he think the job consisted, if not leadership????

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  5. kuffarGamalComment by kuffarGamal
    December 4, 2012 @ 10:01 am

    The big disaster was allowing Ted Kennedy to change the immigration laws. We allowed in entitlement seekers over successful people and now the entitlement seekers are in control and we are plummeting toward disaster.

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    • mrparkerComment by mrparker
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:22 pm

      The Hart-Cellar act which Drunky helped ram through.

      Of course, the problem with Mexico is the lack of border control. They seem to think they can just ignore our immigration laws because of their proximity to us.

      We should learn from the Mexicans though. Just enforce their immigration laws and voting id requirements in the US.

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    • stickmanComment by stickman
      December 5, 2012 @ 5:52 pm

      @Comment by mrparker December 4, 2012 @ 12:22 pm

      It is true that we lack total border security with Mexico – but you are wrong as to why they come. the come because OUR government doesn’t discourage them, OUR government doesn’t discourage those that hire them, and it is possibly true that they KNOW that our social services will serve them at no cost, even above what American citizens can get.

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  6. jarhead0311Comment by jarhead0311
    December 4, 2012 @ 10:06 am

    I couldn’t agree with the two of you more. This idea occurred to me even before Rush commented on the blog article expressing the same idea.

    Stalin said, “It doesn’t matter who votes, it matters who counts the votes.” (Very true in the last election.) What we have to realize today, in the era of a disgustingly compliant lame stream media, is that it doesn’t matter what you do, it matters what it is reported that you do. The real enemy, even more than the ******* collectivists in Washington, is the propaganda arm of the movement. If anyone has a workable solution for solving that problem let me know.
    Let them own the destruction they are bringing on our nation. But if the Republicans compromise on any point of the solution, they will be the ones blamed for Barry’s failure.

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    • empty pocketsComment by empty pockets
      December 6, 2012 @ 8:45 am

      Jarhead…the GOP will be demonized no matter what they do. Therefore I agree with you, they should do what they PROMISED they would do. The talk isn’t about “new” taxes. It’s about letting tax reductions that had a “sunset” date finally lapse. We’ll return to the “Clinton tax rates”. It will remind people Clinton did them no favors and after the dust clears, Obama will own it. More importantly, the GOP will not have lost their leverage or their credibility. Cuts WILL have actually happened. Though the reinstatement of Clinton rates will be painful and damaging to the nation’s economy (and me), not cutting spending would be worse long term. Barry will want to get his own “tax cuts” with his name on them. So he can say “I saved you”. That narcissism in action. We can use that. He’ll want it a lot. And we can give it to him–along with helping him keep another one of his promises (one he didn’t want to keep) to cut government waste with a “scalpel” by eliminating the cost of overlapping government services and agencies…as defined by both government and private groups. Let the video of him making that promise go viral with the GOP saying they want to help him keep it AND reduce the burden on the middle class and the “working poor”. Tax reform in increments instead of omnibus where too much graft, payola and foolish mistakes can be hidden.

      Did he steal the election? That whole “birther” issue started by Hillary Clinton? The demonstrated incompetence in his thugocracy? His thugocracy itself with “Chicago style” politics? We’re stuck with him for now. We can’t change the past but we can change the future. We can work at state and local levels to ensure honest elections going forward. Make better use of the media we have and the social networks, online video such as YouTube. We DO have a great “product”, one that improves the lives of everyone even though just like every single competitive “product”, some will improve more than others…ours has the advantage of real improvements for all and being that word that’s bandied about—sustainable. We’re doing a lousy job of marketing it and picking the right spokespersons then sticking with them AND THE MESSAGE. We don’t have the luxury of compromising on our principles, our message. Doing so now will usher in true single party governance.

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    • Jota_Comment by Jota_
      December 6, 2012 @ 9:41 am

      “the GOP will be demonized no matter what they do. Therefore I agree with you, they should do what they PROMISED they would do” – empty pockets

      I have said it before and I will say it again, let the entire Bush tax cuts expire. It is an indefensible position and will always place the pledge to not increase taxes on the horns of a dilemma

      Why let them expire? Because the Republicans got it the same way the Democrats got Obamacare. When they had power they crammed it down the other’s throat.

      Which I tried to tell Republicans then, what you do unto others don’t be surprised when they do it to you.

      One only need ask themselves, will we ever give up trying to repeal Obamacare?

      Then why think others like having things crammed down their throat

      And what Obama is doing now is using the Bush tax cuts to divide the people and force the Republicans to compromise on a principle, while sacrificing the greatest economic driver in the history of mankind, it is good to win

      If they do cave, who will be able to trust them again?

      In the future there will be only one honest option

      Those who told you up front they will steal from you and did

      and

      Those who told you they will NOT steal from you and did

      Let the entire Bush tax cuts expire

      The primary difference with a liberal and a conservative is whose money they are spending.

      Let more people give their money to the government to spend and see how many new conservatives.

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  7. BobinmsComment by Bobinms
    December 4, 2012 @ 10:40 am

    To understand Obama, you have to realize he is narcissistic.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 11:13 am

      Bobimns, that is true.
      And, if you stop to think of it, nobody who is 100% in their right mind would want the job as President. However, something about Obama’s mental defect scares me more than any thus far within my lifetime.
      I don’t believe that anything anyone thinks bothers him one bit. He has his mind made up as to how things “should” be and nothing is going to change that. Any words or promises to try to work things out and re-unite the nation are nothing but empty chatter because he thinks it sounds good.

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    • janicepComment by janicep
      December 4, 2012 @ 12:50 pm

      I think, by their very nature, ALL politicians are narcissistic. Have you ever honestly met a humble one? I was very heavily involved in the Republican Party from age 14 in the mid 60′s until the late 80′s. I never met anyone at any level in politics who could be described as having humility. It seems to be the nature of the beast.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 2:02 pm

      janicep, I have to disagree that ALL of them area narcissists. Warped in other ways, to be sure. But there is a difference.

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  8. BobinmsComment by Bobinms
    December 4, 2012 @ 11:26 am

    “However, something about Obama’s mental defect scares me more than any thus far within my lifetime.”

    I’m with you Grouchy. It is scary.

    Here are some narcissistic characteristics from Wiki. Does this sound familiar??

    Campbell and Foster (2007)[15] review the literature on narcissism. They argue that narcissists possess the following “basic ingredients”:

    Positive: Narcissists think they are better than others.[16]
    Inflated: Narcissists’ views tend to be contrary to reality. In measures that compare self-report to objective measures, narcissists’ self-views tend to be greatly exaggerated.[17]
    Agentic: Narcissists’ views tend to be most exaggerated in the agentic domain, relative to the communion domain.[clarification needed][16][17]
    Special: Narcissists perceive themselves to be unique and special people.[18]
    Selfish: Research upon narcissists’ behaviour in resource dilemmas supports the case for narcissists as being selfish.[19]
    Oriented toward success: Narcissists are oriented towards success by being, for example, approach oriented.[clarification needed][20]

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  9. wheelerdudeComment by wheelerdude
    December 4, 2012 @ 12:07 pm

    I see many parallels between Obama and Republicans, and the relationships of abused/battered women. Obama is verbally abusive (physically if he could)and treats Republicans or anyone opposed to him for that matter with disrespect and contempt. Republicans are acting like an abuse woman by trying to do anything to try to make the relationship work. Even if it requires one giving up their self-respect, personnal beliefs and principles. Either that, or Republicans are complicit in our Nation’s demise and are trying to “play” the victim. Either way America needs to take control from the Federal Government!

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  10. conserv38Comment by conserv38
    December 4, 2012 @ 12:11 pm

    I agree with those of you that think the Republicans should just say present and not vote on anything and throw it back in Obama’s lap since it seems he plans to send the GOP over the same cliff the economy is going. And yes, big business , not all have moved their plants overseas, but not sticking up for them, they are in these businesses to make money for themselves and their stockholders. Many countries have made it healthier in terms of cost to do business and the money they make for their employees and share holders. This country has, and this is on both sides of the isle, made it with regulations, tases, such as in the state of California, which is driving business away, cause for them to move. I do not agree with this premise, as the jobs are lost to American citizens, but in a busilness sense it is understandable. And as far as small businesses, which should be the mainstay of a blooming economy, they are hindered by unions, EPA regulations that for the most part are unbelieveable, taxes, and now the looming travesty called Obamacare. This President is not offering anything to cut the deficit. A new tax code at a percent of our income both personal and business oriented that is acceptable, and closing many loopholes both personal and in the business climate where there are loopholes not needed or enjoyed by the population as a whole. Republicans just say present, let Obama, Reid and Pelosi go over the cliff in their own barrel then there is no incrimination on the GOP.

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    • stickmanComment by stickman
      December 5, 2012 @ 5:56 pm

      wait until they close that “loophole” called the mortgage interest deduction – the watch as even more houses go into foreclosure.

      For me – it will not make much difference – we paid rent for 21 years until we could afford to BUY a house, even with a mortgage that is no more than our rent was. So the deduction will not hurt me – like it will thousands who depend on the deduction to “tide” them over at tax time. there will be no reason to OWN a home, especially when you KNOW the cost of maintenance.

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  11. gsreaganComment by gsreagan
    December 4, 2012 @ 12:45 pm

    BHO and his minions have several things going for them as they have made a pack with the Devil: 1) The Soros/commie/ liberal groups, 2) the union/democrat groups, 3) the UN and their minions and 4) their EGOs and pocketbooks. He has promised so much to the above elites, and thought that it would be easy to pull off, that he and his minions are in a creditability gap with them. They all are in PANIC MODE and are VERY DESPERATE. They all are part of the New Shadow Government waiting in the wings to govern the New America (the USSA) when the Original America fails. The former USSR (among others) is waiting for the final shoe to drop. This liberal push has been going on since the 1860s with Marx and his writings and took off with Teddy R. and Woodrow Wilson. The European enlightenments and Ruskie revolution helped fuel the fever. Then FDR put the ideology on steroids. JFK was a bump in the road for them but LBJ gave another shot of steroids. Then came along JC, the worst until BHO arrived. If someone doesn’t put this to a collective end soon, the US of A is toast.

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  12. wrightachris1Comment by wrightachris1
    December 4, 2012 @ 1:30 pm

    I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE INABILITY OF THE GOP ELECTED TO FIGHT FIRE WITH FIRE. SINCE THE DEMS CHOOSE TO DIVIDE AND CONQUER. WE CAN PLAY THAT GAME TOO. THERE WAS NO MANDATE OF THE POPULATION. THE PRES WAS REELECTED BY THE MAJOR BLUE CITY RESIDENTS OF THE USA AND SEVERAL MILLION PAST ELECTION VOTERS CHOSE TO SIT THIS ONE OUT. GOP, CONTINUALLY SHOULD BE POINTING OUT WHAT THE BLUE CITY DWELLERS WANT AS IT COMPARES TO THE OTHER RED COUNTIES THAT VOTED RED NOT BLUE. THERE IS NO WAR ON WOMEN OR REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS. IT WAS A MADE UP ISSUE AND THE GOP FAILED TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO COMBAT IT. THE BUDGET ISSUE, TODAY’S DEBATE SHOULD BE TAKEN TO THE PEOPLE IN A BLUE CITY VOTER TO RED COUNTY BATTLE. THE GOP BETTER GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER OR FOLD. THE TEA PARTY DID A BETTER JOB 3 YEARS AGO OF CREATING A GROUND SWELL THAN THIS. MAYBE THE GOP SHOULD DO THAT.

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    • doctorfixitComment by doctorfixit
      December 4, 2012 @ 1:50 pm

      All caps = shouting. We’re on your side.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 1:56 pm

      I also don’t believe that the slander about Romney being against women’s rights did the election any harm. People aren’t that stupid. I believe that it was a given that obama would win long before the first vote was cast.

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  13. gnafuComment by gnafu
    December 4, 2012 @ 1:30 pm

    Obamas whole intent is to have the United States financially ruined. He shows this in spending on speculation projects rather than well known projects that will save the economy. If he were intent on putting Americans back to work, he would have done that by now or at least made an effort. We still have a long way back to some kind of normalcy. When the Electoral College cast their votes on December 17th,and Obama comes out the winner, we will know that E C is part of the problem with this country. Since the 1800′s, Four presidents have been elected by Electoral College even though popular vote was for one of the candidats who ended up losing. Bush and Gore is more current good example.

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  14. doctorfixitComment by doctorfixit
    December 4, 2012 @ 1:49 pm

    There is nothing to be gained in dealing with Democrats. Until the GOP has them cornered like they have the GOP cornered, the GOP will only dig themselves a deeper hole dealing with them. Stop dealing with Democrats until you have them in a position where they must surrender.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 5, 2012 @ 6:38 pm

      Cornered? I don’t think that is any way to run a gov’t and, unfortunately, there will always be “some of each” so probably republicans and democrats will have to deal with each other.

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  15. crosstownbus1Comment by crosstownbus1
    December 4, 2012 @ 2:03 pm

    It was never difficult for Clinton to drive center lane since he was never faced with a hostile house that vowed to make him a one term president. Clinton never endured the wrath of a “tea-party” influenced GOP and a republican electorate that resulted in signed pledges to not work with him. President Obama campaigned on these mandates and he won the election. If the republicans screw this up and they’ll pay again in 2016.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 2:20 pm

      You are forgetting one very important fact. Clinton was/is an AMERICAN and he didn’t set out to traipse around the world bad mouthing Americans and everything they stand for. Clinton didn’t pick a fight with everyone who crossed his path politically or look down his nose at everyone. Obama did. That is the real reason why Clinton didn’t face a hostile house or hostile American citizens.

      I did not vote for Clinton either time and I didn’t especially like him as president but, looking at what we have now, I’d take him in a heartbeat over Obama.

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  16. wrightachris1Comment by wrightachris1
    December 4, 2012 @ 2:11 pm

    The GOP cannot corner or battle the Dems without a game plan. I do not think they have a concept of what to do to regain a popular position. The Dems take credit for emancipation and civil rights when the GOP rightfully deserve the credits denied. Every point of issue should have a point of attack by the GOP. The more you repeat something over and over it becomes fact of belief. For example, if the population receiving welfare was constantly reminded that they have no way out until they take the open handed opportunity of an education or trade, over time they would come to believe it. Currently they are told the GOP wants to deprive them of their due benefits. You can argue with what I just wrote. But, the theme of what I am saying is profoundly true and the elected cannot seem to develop a cohesive rhetoric to sway thought and opinion.

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    • Grouchy OneComment by Grouchy One
      December 4, 2012 @ 2:14 pm

      It’s that give me a handout, Nanny State mentality that has been drummed into the school kids heads for decades. At one time, inner city schools were teaching high school kids how to apply for welfare. It really is a shame that they didn’t teach them something more meaningful, like how to figure out what kind of job would suit them and make them feel most fulfilled.

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  17. freethinkerComment by freethinker
    December 4, 2012 @ 4:12 pm

    This is almost exactly what is laid out in the Cloward-Piven strategy for the destruction of the United States. Crisis after crisis, bringing the gov. ever closer to complete gov. control over every aspect of the lives of our citizens. I believe that this is a concious well thought out plan, with Obama hand picked to lead the charge. With the complete culpability of the main stream media, he is doing exactly what he intended to do when elected in ’08.

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